In B2B PR, we often work with industry trade publications to secure earned media coverage for clients.
A trade magazine, also called a business-to-business magazine or trade journal, is a magazine whose target audience is people who work in a particular trade or industry.
Coverage in the trades helps companies establish themselves as the expert in their space. It’s where a buyer may turn to keep up with industry news and trends and research solutions before making a purchase. Articles that appear in the trade press are commonly cited in search, particularly GEO (generative engine optimization).
What types of news and stories do editors of these media outlets look for? How can PR pros work most effectively with these publications?
I’m talking with guest Kelley Rodriguez, MLIS, Editor in Chief & Event Content Manager at BNP Media on this episode of PR Explored.
Show summary:
Trade Media 101: How to Pitch and Build Relationships in B2B PR (with Kelly Rodriguez)
In this episode of PR Explored, host Michelle Garrett, a PR consultant, author, and writer, interviews her guest Kelly Rodriguez, editor-in-chief of Refrigerated & Frozen Foods (BNP Media), to explain what trade media is and why it matters for B2B PR.
Rodriguez contrasts trade and mainstream coverage, emphasizing trade media’s highly engaged niche audiences, subject-matter expertise, and industry-specific language, using food and beverage examples.
She advises PR pros to know each publication’s coverage area, tailor pitches, include the basics (who/what/when/where/why/how), and offer strong hooks, timeliness, and access (plant tours, trade-show meetings, and knowledgeable spokespeople like C-suite and R&D).
They discuss relationship-building, noting it shouldn’t determine coverage but can improve relevance and responsiveness.
Rodriguez also addresses editorial independence versus paid opportunities, and highlights growing importance of being cited in AI-driven search (GEO/AEO). Both stress providing high-quality, permissioned visuals and captions.
00:00 Welcome and Guest Intro
02:35 What Trade Media Is
03:36 Trade Media vs Mainstream
07:32 Why Niche Coverage Matters
12:56 Inside the Cold Chain World
16:28 Pitching Trade Editors
20:06 Passing Pitches to Peers
22:43 What Makes Pitches Pop
27:06 Trade Shows and Relationships
30:39 Long Timelines in B2B
31:18 PR Editor Partnerships
32:16 Offer Real Experts
33:15 Does Relationship Matter
36:33 Fairness And Fit
37:44 Editorial Versus Paid
43:08 Ads Influence Coverage
48:46 GEO AEO Trade Media
54:19 Visuals That Get Used
56:41 Photo Delivery Rights
59:01 Wrap Up And Thanks
Show notes:
Follow Kelley Rodriguez on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kelleyrodriguez/
Visit Refrigerated & Frozen Foods online: https://www.refrigeratedfrozenfood.com/
Follow Refrigerated & Frozen Foods on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/refrigerated-frozen-foods-magazine/posts/?feedView=all
Full transcript:
Best Practices for Working with Trade Publications
Michelle Garrett: [00:00:00] Hello, everyone, and welcome to PR Explored, the PR podcast where we delve into trends and topics related to public relations. I’m your host, Michelle Garrett, a PR consultant and writer, and today I have with me my guest, Kelly Rodriguez, who’s editor-in-chief of Refrigerated & Frozen Foods, which is part of BNP Media.
Hello, Kelly. Welcome. Thank you, Michelle. Thank you for having me. I’m so happy to have you today. I know, a lot of people do not understand the world of trade media, but it is part of your everyday life and my everyday life. And, I would love, as we kick off here before we start getting into our questions, if you would just tell us a little bit about you and your background and anything that you would like to share.
Kelley Rodriguez: sure. I’m Kelly Rodriguez. I currently serve as editor-in-chief [00:01:00] of Refrigerated & Frozen Foods, which, as Michelle said, is a BNP publication or brand, as we like to call ourselves nowadays. so I represent and cover the cold and frozen processing, manufacturing, and distribution of foods in primarily the United States, but internationally as well.
my background is largely in commercial media, so I hold a bachelor’s in journalism, a bachelor’s in broadcasting from Otterbein University, and a master’s in library and information science. I have held a variety of roles in print, broadcast, radio, and, nonprofit before, taking this role about five years ago with R&FF, and diving into the wonderful world of trade media.
Michelle Garrett: And we, we know each other because we are both in [00:02:00] Columbus, Ohio currently. Yeah. And I have a client here, and, Kelly has actually been out to meet with my client in person, and I, came too just for fun, just to… And, so we do, so we know each other that way. But today Kelly is just joining me out of the goodness of her heart because, I asked her and I, know she’s an expert on this topic, and I was excited that, to have her here,
Kelley Rodriguez: thank you. I’m really, like I said, yeah, I’m really excited to be here and chat about all things B2B and, looking forward to it.
Michelle Garrett: Yeah, we are heavily B2B today. and we are, the topic today is trade media and how… What is trade media? How do you work with trade media? Why does it matter?
Because I feel sometimes, and I say this with love ’cause I think it’s very important, but sometimes people tend to maybe look down a little bit on trade media. they really wanna be in The Wall Street Journal or whatever. So I’m like, you, mep- your audience probably [00:03:00] is more likely looking at the trade publication, potentially than a big, publication like that.
But we’ll talk about it, so and also please ask questions. If anyone has questions about anything we’re talking about, trade media, anything for Kelly, please feel free to ask the question. We’ll do our best to get to it. I’m gonna kinda dive in with the questions that I have, and then, we’ll see, we’ll see where this takes us.
How Trade Publications Different From Other Types of Media
all So our first question is, how… I’m gonna put it up on the screen. How are trade publications different from other types of media?
Kelley Rodriguez: as I said in my, introduction, my primary background, and I have spent the majority of my career outside of this, of, trade media. the last five years I have been entrenched in the trade media world, and it is really vastly [00:04:00] different. you kinda touched on it. A lot of your clients, they probably…
Of course, everybody would love to be the front page of, The New York Times or, something of that nature. but the value of trade media is it is really two different voices, for different audiences. so it’s I, I like to think of it as, mirroring traditional beat reporting.
I got my start in the world of newspapers, which I like to tell people are the original handheld devices. but, back then I had a beat, which was a very niche, narrow, dedicated, sort of field, and B2B media is the same thing. so my, my beat nowadays is refrigerated and frozen processing and manufacturing.
the difference in trade media obviously is you’re [00:05:00] speaking to a, smaller audience, of course, but you’re speaking to an audience that is absolutely 100% engaged. that’s… it’s definitely your… It’s the, the difference between hitting a target and, hitting a bullseye and, hitting a, a wide open field.
It’s, your, audience, is going to be there for whatever particular, publication we’re talking about. in my world, I work, for BNP Media, is our parent org, and we have about 40 different trade brands, within a variety of different industries. So in the food and bev world, we have about nine brands right now.
So I, I’m just one, one of nine. We’re all kinda sisters and brothers, and we work together in the same e- ecosystem, but, where I’m really focused on cold and frozen and the challenges and the [00:06:00] differentiation there in that market, I have peers who are similarly focused on dairy foods.
we have a brand called National Provisioner, which is ex- exclusively protein, and meat processing. and then we have a brand like Food Engineering, which is a little bit further upstream, but that’s talking specifically about the things like plant operations, design of facilities and manufacturing technologies, things of that nature.
and some of that I do touch on, but the difference is it’s got to be in a, cold or frozen environment. So that’s where With a trade pub, you are really drilling down to what makes that specific industry, that specific market, unique from its peers.
Michelle Garrett: Yeah. Absolutely, and again, it is probably more likely that if you are selling to, somebody who’s, in [00:07:00] that realm, they’re more likely- to be reading very specific niche publications. especially if they are trying to keep up on trends, or maybe they’re looking at solutions, or you know- they’re just, trying to keep up with what’s going on. So it makes a lot of sense, and it’s really important. And w- we’ll talk… There are other reasons it’s important.
We’re gonna talk about that in a little bit, too.
Why Trade Coverage Is Vital for B2B Companies
So, the next question is… Okay. So and this, this is exactly what I was saying. So trade publications can sometimes, be overlooked in lieu of coverage in more mainstream publications. So and we’ve talked about it already, but it’s so vital for B2B companies, because that’s where their audience is spending time.
Kelley Rodriguez: Yeah, I think o- one of the, easiest ways to, for me to relate this is when I talk to my friends who are not in the world, not only not in the media world, but in [00:08:00] in my world, the F&B world. There, there are companies, that, Michelle, you and I work with every day who are major players in their industry, but they are not kitchen table household names.
so you know, I, when I tell my friends, I was talking about, I was comparing two cold storage providers and I said, they’re like, how, can I relate this?” I said, “They’re like the Pepsi and Coke, Of, of that particular market.” but they are not household names the way Pepsi and Coke are.
Michelle Garrett: Yeah.
Kelley Rodriguez: And I think particularly, y- every industry is gonna, is going to probably say this, but the food and beverage industry really has its own language, and in many cases its own alphabet. There’s acronyms for everything. Sure. there, there are, Certain cadences of languages and phrases and things that, that I had [00:09:00] certainly never heard, until I entered this world.
Yeah … and just again, f- terminology and things that you’re not ever going to get in a mass media kind of publication. the, difference also in, comes in, into play also with, the people that do the kind of work that, that you and I do and, and my peers here at BNP, and, it, I certainly love my peers in commercial media, and I, like I said, was one of them for a long time.
but they get to cover a lot of things all of the time. a- and I cover, Our funnels are very different. Our news funnels are different. and what ends up happening is when you stick with a, B2B or an industry long enough, you get to learn that language, you get to learn those nuances, and so you become more of a subject matter [00:10:00] expert.
And so- When you are taking a commercial reporter, through a, let’s say, a new plant tour, their questions are going to be very different from the questions that I’m going to ask you, as someone who’s speaking for manufacturing and processing. Because I’m gonna want to ask about the nuances of the equipment and automation and, things that, that quite frankly my peers in commercial media, and no disrespect to them, but they, don’t, you don’t know what you don’t know.
And so they have no … I was on a tour last year of an ice cream manufacturer, in Illinois, and local TV was there. And we, they took us through as a group. So everybody went, trade media, local media, politicians, everybody went through as a group, and we had one big Q&A. And the questions were very vastly different, as you can imagine-
Michelle Garrett: Yes
Kelley Rodriguez: based on what’s my angle and what story I’m trying to tell and [00:11:00] who I’m, my audience is- versus that local nightly reporter. So-
Michelle Garrett: Yeah …
Kelley Rodriguez: yeah, it’s, definitely, it’s, And then, the other thing is when you’re speaking to, a consumer audience, we probably in some respects with food want to know the same thing.
for example, things like clean label and, and protein and all of these things around formulation are really, in the news right now. They’re in the headlines certainly. And the consumer, those things are top of mind for the consumer. but the consumer is going to the store and just wants to be able to see your, label, and see your package and claim and, try your product.
And whereas if you tell me, Kelly, editor-in-chief of Refrigerated and, Frozen Foods, if you say, “Hey, we have this new formulation, [00:12:00] and it’s got higher protein,” I’m gonna have a couple of follow-up questions. Yes. and they’re gonna, they’re gonna they’re gonna have things nothing to do with what that consumer cares about.
They’re gonna, it’s gonna s- I’m gonna say, “Okay, what kind of protein? where are you sourcing it? how, what was the R&D process like? Did you have to change, equipment? How, how did that impact your manufacturing process?” Yep. because as I said, once you get into this industry, you realize that it really is, a delicate balance of art and science.
Michelle Garrett: Okay …
Kelley Rodriguez: and that for a lot of times the consumer might think, “Oh, they’re just throwing protein into everything nowadays.” And, A trade journalist like myself knows that it’s just, it’s not that easy. So- there are no decisions that are ever made, like that, in my industry overnight or on a whim,
Michelle Garrett: Yeah. And it’s fascinating, right? I feel like a nerd sometimes [00:13:00] because I’m really, like I… before I started working with, food processing clients, I had no idea, what went into my food, right? Like- I think it’s pretty interesting. Like
Kelley Rodriguez: I tell people all the time, especially because of the many, great experiences I’ve, had the, opportunity and, really the blessing to have throughout my career, I do tell people all the time, though, “Look, I have, I’ve, covered crime and city council, and I’m telling you, i- ice cream and frozen pizza-
are way better any day.”
Michelle Garrett: Yes. So- ‘Cause I think that’s another thing, and I know from the PR side, I know of, pros who would think, some of this stuff is, boring, boring and- I think it’s really fascinating, and I really get into it because I think, again, being in the factory, going on a tour of the shop floor, see, yeah, and understanding, yeah, if you change up your formulation, then you’re gonna [00:14:00] have to change the way the equipment, is set up to make the product, right?
So there’s a lot of decisions that go into it and just a lot more than, the average person probably thinks. And I’m sure the people that know me are bored hearing me talk about it, but I think it’s really interesting,
Kelley Rodriguez: No one wants to go grocery shopping with me, we’ll put it that way.
I don’t even wanna go… At this point, I don’t even wanna go grocery shopping with me anymore, because I’m spending, like, all this time, And not only, I’m like, “Oh, who made the packaging?” “What’s the packaging made of?” I, so I’m- I
Michelle Garrett: know …
Kelley Rodriguez: so far down the rabbit hole with, Because I just, I, I tell people when I go to the grocery store, it’s market research.
Michelle Garrett: Yeah. No, truly. ‘Cause and I would… This is off topic a little bit, but the, space in the frozen and refrigerated sections of the store is limited, right? So it’s, so these products that get that space, they have to sell so many or they have to [00:15:00] perform well, or they’re probably not gonna continue to carry as m- I that’s, like-
Kelley Rodriguez: that’s a whole… I will tell you, to plug for my neck of the woods, I will tell you that the next time you go to the grocery store- The, i- if you walk the store, the perimeter, which is the cold section and the frozen section, that is what’s growing. So if- Okay … if, my, our local Kroger here, many of them are under renovation.
If you, the next time… I would challenge your viewers, the next time you go to your local grocery store, start watching and look how, look at how many cold cases have been added. and then also not where, not necessarily, where you might expect. So we’re starting to see little cold cases pop up in ambient aisles, like coffee creamer- Yeah
next to the coffee, or the refrigerated dog pet food, in the dog and cat food aisle with- Yeah … the ambient stuff. So all of that is cold and frozen. So just… I [00:16:00]
Michelle Garrett: think I saw that in the pasta aisle maybe. There was like- Yes … some refrigerated pasta where the-
Kelley Rodriguez: The pasta sauce … bottles. Yeah.
Michelle Garrett: Yeah.
Kelley Rodriguez: And the, and they’ll merchandise the, some of the cheese and like the, or pesto and,
Michelle Garrett: Yeah
Kelley Rodriguez: so yeah. It’s- So
Michelle Garrett: that’s interesting too …
Kelley Rodriguez: it’s a fun time to def- to be in this industry, we’ll put it that way.
Michelle Garrett: Yeah. Yeah. I’m, very interested in this. I think more people need to, get into it.
What Types of News and Stories Are Best to Pitch to Trade Publication Editors?
Anyway, so let’s talk about, if you are pitching, editors of trade publications, what type of news and stories are make the best, to pitch to somebody like you?
Kelley Rodriguez: So I, I think my first piece of advice would be to know your audience. and by that, I mean know your trade audience, because even though, we are trade media, it, and this might surprise some [00:17:00] people, I know it surprised me when I got into this side of the business, there’s still a lot of nuance in, trade media.
there, there are, food publications that focus more on, the financial business side of, just food and bev. There are, publications that focus, heavier into the, in depth maybe scientific, PhD, s- like scholarly level, journals and things of that nature.
So I, I think that’s probably my number one, piece of advice is to make sure that your pitch matches the publication that you’re pitching it to. and, all that to say, I get a li- I get a fair amount of pitches that are for things, that are not in my coverage area. for example, they might be [00:18:00] ambient, and so that’s where, before I talked about at BNP, I have peers who certainly cover, ambient food production and R&D and things of that nature.
and this is where, trade media can really, also come to help, help your brand because, there’s lots of places to put that ambient, coverage. but refrigerated and frozen foods is not one of them so-
I would s- I would say probably, like 10% of the pitches I get are probably automatically I just have to DQ,
Michelle Garrett: Yeah.
Kelley Rodriguez: because they just do not fit my coverage area at all. and being in food and beverage, everyone says this, “Review our restaurant,” or, “Would you like to review this chef?” Also, no. Despite the [00:19:00] fact a lot of my friends, I think they think I’m, like, a food critic or something. but, so I would say that’s probably my number one piece of advice.
Michelle Garrett: Yeah.
Kelley Rodriguez: Yeah, is to make sure that it kind of matches, And then from there it’s does it have value? Does it have a hook? I- is there a timeliness to it? Is there, for me, I always wanna know the basics, the who, what, when, where, why, and how.
Michelle Garrett: Yes. Yeah. And often, we…
and again, this is gonna be something else, that comes up at times is, people will frown on press releases, but working with trade media, often the press release is what they need, want, or ask you for, so if you don’t have a press release, then you have to put together the information anyway. So I’m like, of course you y- yes, you would wanna write a press release if you had a new product, for example, [00:20:00] of course.
‘Cause it is gonna answer all those questions, and then you… We’ll talk about visuals too- ’cause I think that’s really important. But yeah, you just, the basics have to be there, the other question, another question I had about this is you mentioned, sometimes you get pitches that aren’t a fit for you, but then you have, your fellow editors at the other publications under your umbrella. Do you ever pass off a pitch to somebody else or tell, maybe take… you probably don’t have time to do this, but do you ever, reply and say, “Hey, this would be a better fit for this person or this editor”?
Do you ever do that?
Kelley Rodriguez: And I can’t speak for my other friends. I have peers who work at other B2B, companies and they’re, they are great people, so I’m sure that they [00:21:00] are as well. but I definitely, we do here. we have a, cohesive F&B team, that is, trying to look at things holistically, and there are a lot of natural overlaps.
for me the probably the most obvious one is dairy foods. If you think about how much of the cold refrigerated, excuse me, refrigerated and frozen, if you think about how much of those cases are made up of dairy products, there’s a lot of natural overlap there. so I definitely do.
we pass stories and pitches, and we actually, we make, we n- we make introductions for each other, y- pretty frequently. so you know, you and I were, talking before, offline before this started. I, I jokingly, I kinda call myself the cold chain queen now, so-
if it’s cold or frozen [00:22:00] if somebody else gets it, they better be sending it to me, yeah.
Michelle Garrett: That’s right.
Kelley Rodriguez: That way.
Michelle Garrett: and you’re very kind, and I will say, I’ve worked with a lot of, editors throughout my career in PR- Oh, I appreciate that … and a lot often they won’t take the time to, help you or i- especially if you’re new, working with a client or are new to an industry, those, certainly those people are not as, they, might need a little extra advice or something.
So it’s really nice- when editors take time to do that. But of course we know you’re busy and we know not everybody has time, but we appreciate it.
Absolutely.
What Makes a Pitch Stand Out?
this, kinda dovetails on to the last question, but, what are you, what makes a pitch stand out? You mentioned how a lot of times there are some immediate, disqualifying factors that in something, a pitch you receive, but what are you really looking for?[00:23:00]
is there anything else that kinda makes something stand out to you?
Kelley Rodriguez: I would say I probably get about a, roughly a dozen a week, so let’s, give or take. and like I said, probably three or four of those right off the bat I can disregard. I, would say there’s a few things. we’re always looking for unique stories.
We’re always looking for something untold
in my I, in my specific industry right now, there’s a lot of emerging, what we like to call category disruption. so that’s, an obvious space, where I’m gonna probably be receptive to that. another thing is, anytime you can provide, access, [00:24:00] particularly to a B&B publication, anytime you can provide access, whether it’s like something like a plant tour or, Michelle, you talked earlier, one of your clients, is based in Columbus, and they are an OEM, and it was great for me to go out there.
I, I, it wasn’t for a specific piece of content, but it was great, industry education for me. And, they’re in h- our backyard, and so it was really easy for me to go out there and see their facility firsthand and get a better understanding, of how some of these pieces of equipment are built, how they operate, how they’re repaired, how they’re maintained.
a- another great opportunity is, setting up things on, at trade shows and, because you only get into a handful of these facilities, usually a year if you’re lucky, and, it’s, [00:25:00] really impressive to see a lot of those, equipment and things set up and either operational or somewhat operational.
it helps our understanding, and I think it helps, provide better content and, ultimately a better experience for our audience. And, what I’m trying to do at the end of the day is just provide, clear, concise, reliable, independent information, for frozen and refrigerated manufacturers and processors.
And a lot of times they, want to see, what their competition is doing, and not necessarily, to that end, not that I’m giving away the, family secrets, there’s no… I’m not disclosing the 11, what the 11 herbs and spices are. we’d n- we’d never seek to do that, but, but once you can get in and [00:26:00] see how the sausage is made, so to speak- Yeah … for lack of a better description, it really does make a tremendous difference.
Michelle Garrett: Yeah.
Kelley Rodriguez: So I would say any time a, pitch has anything of that, of that caliber or… And the other thing is access.
for me, I, w- I want to talk to, the s- the C-suite largely, and, and I, wanna talk to the folks in R&D, and the folks, running the packaging lines, and, and it, it- It also depends on the publication as well. when I talk about, my sister pubs, Food Engineering, they really want to talk to the operations folks.
Michelle Garrett: Yeah …
Kelley Rodriguez: we have a brand called Packaging Strategies. So of course they, all of it, all they want to do is, they wanna talk to the packaging engineers and, the high level people that are helping to make, make the decisions [00:27:00] and, ultimately bring new products to market.
Build Relationships with Media Trade Shows
Michelle Garrett: Yeah. you’ve brought up a couple things that are really good tips I love because trade shows, first of all, you’re there. The, companies are there. The PR person can get a list of the press that will be at the show if they’re exhibiting, if the company’s exhibiting, so you can…
It’s very, it’s very easy. They will offer, they will give it to you. You have to ask often, but they will give it to you. And you can contact the editors ahead of time, set up 15, 20 minutes or whatever in the booth. Have the editor come to the booth and talk to your spokesperson, your CEO, whoever it is.
and that is a great… Even if it’s not, I think this is another thing, and you’ve mentioned a couple times, even if it’s not for a specific story right now, it’s a relationship building. it’s important for that. And then it’s gonna be, that relationship is [00:28:00] gonna be real because you’ve met in person.
That just makes a huge difference, right? So if you were working on a story, a few months later and you thought, “Oh yeah, I talked to Joe, Blow at that show,” you’re gonna be able to say- Oh … he would be a great, he would probably have a comment for this. And then, that would end up with the company featured in a story or included in a story.
So that’s a really important tip.
Kelley Rodriguez: Yeah, I, and I would say that I would s- I, yes, I agree with you. And, I know one of the, I think one of, one of your questions, later on, has to do with, people entering the field. And, Yeah … and I would say that things like that are really invaluable because…
And I’m gonna tell you, it’s also no different, it’s largely no different in the commercial media world. if I was working on a story that wasn’t a breaking news piece, but if I was working on a story where I needed a subject matter expert, y- [00:29:00] you’re, going to rely on who you know and, and you know who you can call.
And it’s really no different in, the B2B, industry world. the, timelines are probably much different. The timelines are usually much longer. but- yeah, it, your, your, client is a great example. Every year I, meet up with, them at a trade show-
Michelle Garrett: Yeah
Kelley Rodriguez: just to touch base. And when I go to, I go to probably about a half dozen trade shows a year. Typically, when I go to them I may have a future piece of content in mind, but chances are good that I don’t. there’s a really good chance that I’m just looking to make a connection, build a relationship, and see how we could work together potentially in the [00:30:00] future. Yeah. and then what happens is, eventually your client, I th- your client has approached a few, a few, case studies and whatnot- Yeah … through us. Yeah. and that’s a great example because they are and then you’ll say, “Hey, I have a case study,” and it, it absolutely relates to your, category.
So for me that’s a no-brainer because, ’cause I already h- have a, an established kind of relationship with you, Michelle, with the client that you’re representing, so laying the groundwork. Yeah … and particularly in, in this industry where, it, it takes let’s say two years, give or take, to, build a new facility, a food production facility.
and it’s probably a year to two at least of planning before that. Yeah … so if you’re talking about, [00:31:00] me wanting to cover let’s say something like new food facilities- Yeah … that’s not a, 24-hour news cycle turnaround. that’s, gonna be me laying the groundwork and waiting, And-
Michelle Garrett: Yeah …
Kelley Rodriguez: and hoping that relationship comes to fruition at the end. And-
Michelle Garrett: Yeah …
Kelley Rodriguez: and typically they do.
Michelle Garrett: Yeah. And I just feel often, I feel like, and again this is just a more general PR 101 type of thing, but I feel like sometimes, editors and PR pros kinda have a, they don’t always have the most positive of a relationship or like…
But I always feel like it can be really positive. And I feel if you came to me and asked me for a resource that I could give you, I would bend over backwards to do that for you because we know each other and we have a relationship. So there is something to be gained [00:32:00] on the editorial side, as well as, the PR pro.
I always feel like we have, we are asking more of the editor, but then there is, there can be a give and take there a little bit too I think,
Kelley Rodriguez: Yeah, absolutely
Offer Your Experts to Meet with Editors
Michelle Garrett: Yeah. And then the other thing that you said that I think is really important is, offer up your experts, right? So for us and with the client we’re talking about, it is the CEO because he enjoys that. that, that’s, he likes doing those, interviews and those discussions, and he loves talking to people and, he’s a, got a big personality.
That’s, his, that’s how he is. But, you can always, if you have a spokesperson that’s an expert, from another, division of the company or somebody else in the C-suite, just be sure that you’re, putting the people in front of the editor that really can talk and answer questions, very specific questions that a trade editor might ask if you, are meeting with them.
[00:33:00] So that’s, I think that’s really important too.
Does Having a Relationship with an Editor Make a Difference in Landing Media Coverage?
we have covered what makes you disregard a pitch, so I’m not gonna, I’m not gonna post that question ’cause we’ve, talked about that. we’ve talked about relationship building. One question I have, we’ve talked about some ways you can build a relationship, but do you think that having a relationship makes a difference, when people are pitching you?
Do you… you don’t, I wouldn’t think that you would treat it differently, but may- but maybe you can speak to this a little bit.
Kelley Rodriguez: No, I don’t see it having … Let me put it this way, it shouldn’t have a, dramatic difference. a, good pitch and a good story should stand out and will be a, good piece of [00:34:00] content, regardless. but that being said, it’s human nature, so
When I see somebody, like when I see your name, “Oh, an email from Michelle. Okay, let… I, I know it’s gonna, I know it’s going to be something relevant first.” For sure. ‘Cause Michelle knows me, so I know it’s going to be something relevant. It might not be earth-shattering, and it might not need my attention right away, but I can at least, “Okay, this is gonna be, this is gonna be worth my time.”
when you’re, leading, through that initial inbox every morning. But, no, I would say that building, building a relationship, often might happen after a pitch. you might, And, I’ve had people pitch… I t- I just recently had, a PR, woman from California pitch me a really great story.
I was on [00:35:00] board, and the company that she was pitching backed out, and, that’s- fine. Fine. it… I don’t, I don’t hold that against her certainly. I, and I, we just, and we’ve spoken before on the phone, we’ve, and so I do, I really hope that the next time she has a pitch, that we, can, work together and, that, that story can come to fruition.
but ultimately- Yeah … no, I, having a relationship doesn’t, doesn’t affect the outcome of, eventual coverage or anything like that.
Michelle Garrett: Okay. Yeah, no, I think that’s really important too, ’cause I think a lot of times people get hung up on that. And I know when I talk to prospective clients, sometimes they wanna know, “Who do you know?
Which, which editors do you have a relationship with?” And I’m like, it doesn’t really [00:36:00] matter.” if you the client, you the company doesn’t ha- don’t, you don’t have the goods, you don’t bring, you’re not bringing anything interesting to the table as far as- customers, products, case studies, solutions, whatever it is, you’ve gotta have something there.
Or even if I had a relationship, the editor is gonna not, is not gonna say, “Yeah, sure, we’ll just publish-” something. You, you have told me no before. So And that’s cool. And that’s, it- ‘Cause it doesn’t make sense … it does- it doesn’t …
Kelley Rodriguez: yeah, it does. It is… I had to actually, I got a great pitch this morning, but I had just published a case study from their division recently, and so- yeah
same kind of thing. And so I h- Yeah … I had to turn it down just for the sake of, eh, I hate to say it, but for the sake of fairness. I try to- yeah … I, we-
Michelle Garrett: Yeah …
Kelley Rodriguez: pride ourselves for that, and, and she understood. I said, [00:37:00] “Oh-” Yeah.
Michelle Garrett: No, it’s a mutual respect, again
Kelley Rodriguez: My wish is your command.
You
Michelle Garrett: want this story …
Yeah, so we, so yeah, yeah. So and I try not to do that, but the other thing that sometimes happens is because, I would pitch multiple pubs under that umbrella, sometimes a pitch is a better fit for one than another, and they’re not all gonna run it, so you know, that, that’s something.
Again, it’s a nuance, but like I get it because this is, this is what I do, But anyway, don’t take it personally always if, if an editor- … tends to be going on the PR side, PR side. so we, talked about like how do you work with the editor. I wanna talk a little bit about how do you work with a publication, most effectively.
The Difference Between True Earned Media – and Pay-to-Play
Obviously, we’ve talked about pitching stories, and what about other ways? Are there other things that we could do or we could talk to our [00:38:00] clients about doing?
Kelley Rodriguez: one of the sto- one of the questions that I get asked a lot of times is, even when I pitch people and I say, “Hey, I’d like to do a story on, you, on X, Y, Z,” Yeah
and a lot of times they say, “Is there a cost?” “Do, is there a cost associated?”
Michelle Garrett: Yeah.
Kelley Rodriguez: and I always say- Yeah … “No.” So you know-
we are still, we still have that separation, of church and state, so to speak. I am still doing editorial work and editorial based content.
i- however, alongside of that, there is an opportunity in B2B, there is an opportunity to do different, obviously, different types of, communication and, marketing. So there’s a lot of times where, the best example of this- is I have done a few [00:39:00] podcasts, in the past. They were strictly editorial, and, I don’t even believe I was aware that, these, this company had…
was a, an existing client of ours. some- sometimes I’m aware that they might be an advertiser with, our parent company. and oftentimes I’m not because like I said, I’m, in my, cold chain world over here. there’s been times when editorial content, has been repurposed and later used, on the marketing side, on the, paid side.
and that’s one of the best ways, I think, that the, a true kind of partnership or a true cohesive model, if you did have clients that wanted, that were looking for non-editorial opportunities in BC. there’s a way that they can coexist [00:40:00] and walk alongside of one another- without it being a, pay-to-play type of, scenario.
’cause that is, yeah, that’s definitely not what I do as editor and, none of our, the editorial folks here, on, my side of things, at BNP. that’s certainly not what we’re about. But, but there are things, there are companies in which we do editorial, pieces and then they may be existing advertisers.
They may become advertisers at a later point.
Michelle Garrett: Yeah …
Kelley Rodriguez: but usually it has- Yeah … it has very minimal to do with, with my interaction, for on an editorial side. other than the fact that, hopefully I’m representing our brand and, our company well. But, but there is no, paying for access or, [00:41:00] guiding the voice kind of thing.
Michelle Garrett: Yeah. a couple things, ’cause there are, o- obviously, I, y- you, your company would never do this. We would never do this. There are a lot of them that, that might be doing that, and I understand it because, I know some of them are struggling and so forth, and it, I guess it makes sense.
But I think it makes, clients really gun-shy sometimes because they’re like, they don’t understand the difference. And sometimes those companies will pitch directly to the C-suite and try to s- you know, appeal to their ego to get them to pay for something. And I’m always like, let’s, look at…
If you have money to spend on the paid side, let’s look at what makes sense.” ‘Cause it probably makes more sense to be working with somebody, a trade publication or the trade media than random person that got in touch and has started a publication that, is pay to play. So I, yeah. I- [00:42:00]
Kelley Rodriguez: And that’s why, too, where there are ways to, maybe I… Maybe there’s a great piece of content where there was an interview or a, piece that, featured your CEO or featured, your CFO or, something of that nature, and then down the line you wanna amplify that, through- Yes. Yeah.
Michelle Garrett: Yep …
Kelley Rodriguez: through, through a paid program. That’s, that’s a different sort of, It’s a, different, it’s a different sort of way of looking at things because also you’re then, you’re amplifying, you’re, boosting, whatever word you wanna use. you’re helping to spread, a piece of legitimate editorial content that was edit- that was standalone, on its own and was not, guided in any way, Yeah
from the ad- a- at the advertorial side of things.
Michelle Garrett: And the, like I said, if I… I always encourage clients, if [00:43:00] they can, obviously I’m there to help them with earned media primarily, but if they have budget to spend on the paid side, it makes a lot of sense.
Does Working with a Publication on the Paid Media Side Help Build a Relationship with the Editorial Side?
but here is a real, another question that I have, because sometimes I feel like if you can’t get in front of an editor, you, you just don’t get a reply, right?
And you’re trying to, get… The client really wants to be in a publication. So sometimes I wonder if they do work on the paid side if that might get them more attention, but I’m sure it’s probably on a case by case basis.
Kelley Rodriguez: Yeah, I would say it’s probably- Thank you … really more of a case by case basis. and it’s probably gonna come after probably some time. I’ve, only had this happen a handful of times where, one of our sales strategists will say, “Hey, [00:44:00] I have a client and they would really like you know, could you think about featuring them in X, Y, Z?”
And- Yeah … and that’s the best, that’s the best way for, me personally because oftentimes, I might not have known, like I said, I might not have known that you had this, client or, with us with nine brands, they might not be advertising in refrigerated and frozen foods and, I might not know that they exist, but they might be a really good industry voice for a topic that I’m working on, we can take sustainability as a, an easy one, and it’s certainly a very buzzy topic right now. And so there’s a lot of companies, in food and bev that are in the space of sustainability. So whether it be, water, reducing your water usage, renewable energy, [00:45:00] grid reliance, things of this nature.
There’s a lot of companies, and some of them are, probably our advertisers, and they might make great sources for me on the editorial side for an article on, let’s say, like sustainable plant construction. So- there are times when the editors will reach out to sales and say, “Hey, I’m doing a story on a very, narrow kind of, topic.
Does anybody have any-” sales con, any contact. Are there any- advertisers that work in this space? and that’s probably the way that, that I see it happening more frequently. it’s usually- Yeah … driven by the editor that’s looking for somebody that we already know. a- and that’s not necessarily just because they’re an advertiser, but it’s-
oh, we have a relationship with them as a company. And they’re probably going to be more willing to speak to me, or get a [00:46:00] C-suite quote than if they had no relationship with our company at all.
Michelle Garrett: Yeah. See, that just makes sense to me, it’s common sense. ‘Cause I feel like this is a little bit of a taboo question or topic sometimes, and I’m like, now just think about it.”
That’s… Because, if it were you, of course if somebody were, y- I don’t know. it just… th- it’s a relationship. It’s a little bit of a different kind of relationship, but it can still maybe make a difference if you really are, striking out on the editorial side. But also you have to look at what you’re pitching, is it a fit, ’cause that, at the end of the day, that really should be the biggest thing.
But sometimes I don’t think a little, a little of both, can- Yeah … be helpful, Yeah, thank you for talking about that, ’cause I’ve said that before and other PR people will look at me like, you should never say that.” And I’m like, yeah, but it’s it’s a, a, something that happens,” and, [00:47:00] I think we all know that, so I don’t know.
That’s, I don’t think-
Kelley Rodriguez: it is interesting. I have had, I have experienced, before, I have experienced kind of the opposite. I, have experienced pressure to not, talk to someone because they were not advertising.
Michelle Garrett: Okay.
Kelley Rodriguez: And, my pushback on that was, again, I’m, on the editorial side. And I’ll use the Pepsi/Coke scenario, and, this was like the Pepsi to the Coke, if, you were.
And, y- and I pushed back and I said, “Oh-” that’s not the way I, I believe in, in, in doing business. And and long story short, years later, we have rebuilt that relationship, so on both the editorial, and the advertising side. [00:48:00]
but, a lot of that was due to the editorial side just saying, “We’re not gonna blacklist people, because they turned you down for advertising.”
that’s… I wouldn’t be doing my job, as an editor and I wouldn’t be serving the industry that way. see- It can work both ways. it’s
Michelle Garrett: interesting. Yeah, I’ve had an editor tell me they won’t do editorial because the client is paying, which is a, that, that’s the… I’ve only had that happen one time, and it’s…
That’s interesting. I’m like, okay. Wow. It’s interesting. Anyway, let’s… I, we’re, we’ve got, about 10 minutes and I’ve got several questions I think are important to get to. I’m gonna, I’m gonna skip over a couple.
Trade Media Coverage Helps Companies with Their GEO (Generative Engine Optimization)
But, this next question I think, and I don’t know, obviously, you and I are not, search experts, but I feel like GEO, which is AI, driven search, right?
SEO, [00:49:00] GEO, blah, blah, blah. it’s, it… We feel like, I feel like trade coverage is more important because companies are understanding that often the GEO, the AI driven search is citing the articles in the trade publications, ’cause they see that as a source, an expert source on a topic. So are you… D- what do you think about that?
Kelley Rodriguez: so I have to throw in another one, which is AEO also, which kind of- Yeah … lands in the middle of those-
Michelle Garrett: Yeah …
Kelley Rodriguez: the answer engine optimization. I will tell you that, we, here, at BNP Media are Fully embracing this. we, B2B media, you’re absolutely right, we are experiencing, we’re having a m- a bit of a moment.
n- not to brag, but if you do, [00:50:00] ask ChatGPT a question about refrigerated and frozen foods, in the United States, chances are good you’re going to get something that, that we have published. Really? … so it’s, hugely important. Yeah … it is really, yeah, it’s impacting all sorts of things.
It’s impacting the way we’re packaging content, it’s impacting the way that we’re writing headlines, it’s impacting, Oh, gosh. m- maybe it’s, The other thing it’s, doing is it’s really putting, a tremendous amount of,
of impor- importance on, all of the possible niche. I know, Michelle, you, you said, “What about, photos and photo captions?” And, Yeah … all of those pieces of data are hugely important now. [00:51:00] i- it’s really… it’s, something that we think about every day.
and it is really becoming important to be cited. Yeah. It’s, crazy the statistics on year-over-year change. it’s revolutionizing, anybody that, that runs a website and, certainly we have a website. Yeah … we’re all feeling it from a, standpoint of visitors to our website because, the Googles, of the world, the search engines are taking a lot of those direct hits.
Yeah … they’re taking that experience away because the user is getting their answer right there, in that- Yeah … AEO or GEO-generated response. and it is fascinating because, it used to be all about clicks to your website, and then time spent on [00:52:00] your site, and things of that nature.
and now we are definitely seeing a push. you’re absolutely right, especially in B2B, if you can be cited, in that quick, in that immediate answer box from Gemini or whoever your, whoever your client, your chat client may be Yep … it’s becoming huge. and it’s, and w- one of the, one of the areas, too, it’s hard to quantify is that it’s, it’s becoming important for, brand awareness, brand loyalty.
a- again, we, talked about how w-
One of the things that, that I wanna do in my day today is talk to subject matter experts. So experts can be huge, for trust.
Michelle Garrett: Yep. Yeah. I, love it because [00:53:00] I feel like, again, I, I have been working with B2B companies and trade media for so long, and I just love to see this getting its day in the sun.
I’m like, oh, ’cause a lot of times, I can’t even- Yeah … look down on it a little bit or, be like, it’s just the trades.” And I’m like, now let’s, and now there’s more
Kelley Rodriguez: because- The first time, the first time we put a prompt into ChatGPT
and it came back, I think two out of the three respo- two out of the three citations were coming up real straight, and it was one of those things like, ooh, the teacher called on you,
Michelle Garrett: Yeah,
Kelley Rodriguez: but it was pretty cool. Yeah,
Michelle Garrett: yeah.
No, we’ve been living this life for a long time, but now it’s gonna be like, okay, everybody is [00:54:00] seeing the importance.
And I will say, the best time to start, working in PR and working with earned media and trade media was probably five years ago, 10 years ago, but the second-best time is today, is now. So you’ve gotta get started if you haven’t done it. But, but yeah.
Trade Publications Appreciate Strong Visuals
We just touched on visuals, and I know we’re running out of time here, but I really think it’s important because again, this is another thing.
‘Cause people will say, how do we get in front of this publication? How do we get in front of this editor? How can we get them to cover us?” If you invest some, resources into nice, high resolution vis- visuals taken in your plant, taken of your products- Yeah … they’re really important, right?
I mean-
Kelley Rodriguez: Yeah, they’re hugely important. particularly again in, in, this era, in this industry, in food and bev, it’s, y- nothing against Getty Images, love the Getty, but, [00:55:00] it’s, really hard to find really industry specific images, on Getty, particularly when we’re talking about detailed, or patented, processing equipment or things of this nature.
so I, totally agree. And, there are ways to photograph and, video and, shoot your machinery, and your facility without, let’s say compromising any, name brands or, things of that nature. and people like me, again in, in B2B media are very amenable to that. We understand that, y- a private label processor for example, not wanted as clients are.
So we, understand, nuances around photography, but I absolutely agree [00:56:00] with you. It’s definitely one of the probably low hanging, the hanging fruit, the, easiest you could do today, would be to get some high quality visuals and, and video if you have it. Absolutely.
Michelle Garrett: Yeah. And if you take it with your phone, this is just a tip, save it in the highest resolution possible because that’s another thing.
Sometimes I… the client will send photos, but the resolution is a little low- Yeah … and it’s, that’s tough. if you’re gonna take time and maybe- even hire a photographer or videographer, wow, that’s an idea, make sure that, you’re getting very high resolution. If you hire a professional, you’re probably gonna have to…
you’re probably not gonna have to worry about that as much, but I know a lot of people like to do it themselves, and do you care if it’s attached or s- someone sends a link to like a Google Drive or a Dropbox link?
Or does, it matter to you? ‘Cause, this question comes up a [00:57:00] lot too, in my world.
Kelley Rodriguez: No, no, typically no, it doesn’t matter. we work with all, I work with all kinds of different Dropbox file sharing sites. Okay. So as long as you can get me, the image, Okay … and as long as we have permission to use it, that’s, that’s another big one. Yeah. we’re always, we are focused on too, is that, permission, the attribution, the cut line, things of that nature.
So yeah.
Michelle Garrett: Yeah. Yeah. That’s important. They have, to have permission to use the photo. if they took the photo, that’s almost then you, they own the photo, so that’s… And never send stock photos. That’s, I’ve seen that happen too. I’m like, “No.” What would, why would you do that? A lot.
Kelley Rodriguez: A lot.
Michelle Garrett: Really? Isn’t that funny? I just find that again, a lot of [00:58:00] it is common sense, but maybe common sense isn’t as common as I like to think that it should be, but yeah, no thank you. ‘Cause I talk about that all the time and I’m like- And I always
Kelley Rodriguez: say, “Thanks,” but I keep-
Michelle Garrett: Yeah. but just thinking about it ahead of time too.
‘Cause if you only have one shot at getting visuals of the client’s facility or something, you should make sure that you’re capturing visuals that you can use. And maybe that does mean that it, they can’t show the customer’s name or something like that. people are obviously very, I think there’s a lot of privacy concerns about that.
yeah, it’s just something to think about. ‘Cause again, it seems like a very overlooked piece of pitching stories, because editors like to have a pretty picture because it, draws the reader in and obviously, it’s, it just tells the story in and of itself [00:59:00] if it’s well done, right? it helps with that, we are at our hour, and I, I don’t know if there’s anything else you wanna add. I had more questions, but we had such a great conversation, and I’m gonna, I’m gonna stop asking questions, so
Kelley Rodriguez: Okay. Thank you so much for having me. And, if anyone, feel free to, to add me on LinkedIn. and, yeah, it’s great to be here and answer some questions, and I’d love to come back.
Michelle Garrett: that would be great, and I really appreciate your time and your willingness to do this. And I know, again, I’m so glad and grateful that we do have a relationship because, it’s
It was, a little awkward for me to ask because I wasn’t sure, how open you would be to it, but I really appreciate that you, were so candid and shared with us, [01:00:00] your process and how you work and all of that. So I really wanna thank you so much. And I’m putting Kelly’s LinkedIn, in the chat right now.
And, I wanna thank you so much, Kelly, for being here. And thanks everybody, for listening, watching. And I’ll be back on, the, 25th, and I will see you then. Thanks so much.
About the host: Michelle Garrett is a B2B PR consultant, media relations consultant, writer and author of B2B PR That Gets Results, an Amazon Best Seller. She helps companies create content, earn media coverage, and position themselves as thought leaders in their industry. Michelle’s articles have been featured by Entrepreneur, Content Marketing Institute, Muck Rack, and Ragan’s PR Daily, among others. She’s a frequent speaker on public relations, marketing and content. Michelle has been repeatedly ranked among the top ten most influential PR professionals.
Learn more about Michelle’s freelance PR consulting services here. Book a no-obligation call to talk about your needs here. Buy Michelle’s book here.
